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Confidential Kazaa Documents Revealed in Court

Postby SlyckTom » Wed Feb 02, 2005 1:02 pm

It appears that Sharman Networks has suffered a setback in its ongoing litigation with the Australian music industry. Ok, painting Sharmam's legal situation with such a broad term may not reflect the entire situation. Specifically, Sharman Networks this week suffered a very embarrassing setback against the music industry.

According to a court reporter from Apgmag.com, Sharman Networks and Altnet attempted to preserve the confidentiality of 30 documents. These documents included contracts, emails and very revealing internal memos. While the legal contracts between Sharman and Altnet are fairly standard, the internal manifesto written by CTO Phil Morle clearly indicate that Kazaa was in serious trouble from its competition.

FastTrack, the network that Kazaa connects to, is terribly outdated compared to eDonkey2000 or BitTorrent. FastTrack’s file-identifying (hashing), searching, network architecture and Windows-only nature makes it an easy target for competitors. Although the P2P community has long recognized this, few knew Sharman Networks’ CTO Phil Morle readily admitted to this also.

From <a href=http://www.apcmag.com/apc/v3.nsf/0/DF26FB51F377707ACA256F9C002C1F09#1 target="_blank">Apcmag.com</a>:

<i>True p2p apps such as eDonkey are devaluing FastTrack and “biting at out heels” says Morle. Others are creating plug-ins that let users get on FastTrack without the need for Kazaa. “We need to move fast with next generation technologies to beat this commercial threat.”</i>

<i>“Our competitors (notably eDonkey and Morpheus) are taking risks legally, but delivering compelling consumer solutions. We need confidence in what we do and must take similar leaps of faith. EDonkey is not yet being sued and is in a strong position to out-innovate us.”</i>

Negating the "anti-spyware" propaganda on the Kazaa.com website, Phile Morle clearly states that the adware laden Kazaa Media Desktop has been a detriment to its success. Exposure to other non-spyware applications such as Ares, WinMX, various BitTorrent clients, e-Mule, etc. gives users little reason to stick with the FastTrack network. Morle explains:

<i>“We need to be careful with user resources. Most obvious is in the adware we add to their machine upon installation. This software slows down users’ machines and can affect other activity such as browsing the Internet (as we have seen with PerfectNav). It is reasonable that we show ads in order to create our free software, but I do not believe it is reasonable to place a user in a position where this free software will also make their machine sluggish. Consider how many people that work for Sharman Networks and its partners that hate installing Kazaa on their machines. ”</i>

As one reads the article from Apcmag.com, it becomes obvious why Sharman Networks did not want this image-damaging information exposed. In addition, Sharman did not want the legal contract of Sharmans purchase of Kazaa released. According to the Apgmag.com, Sharman purchased the rights to Kazaa for approximately $1,000,000. What a rip-off.
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Postby cleavebledread » Wed Feb 02, 2005 1:16 pm

well, it sure is ambarrasing for Phil Morle, I wouldn't want to be him
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Postby Drake » Wed Feb 02, 2005 1:26 pm

We need to be careful with user resources. Most obvious is in the adware we add to their machine upon installation. This software slows down users’ machines and can affect other activity such as browsing the Internet (as we have seen with PerfectNav). It is reasonable that we show ads in order to create our free software, but I do not believe it is reasonable to place a user in a position where this free software will also make their machine sluggish. Consider how many people that work for Sharman Networks and its partners that hate installing Kazaa on their machines.


Finally some honesty!!!!!
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Postby The_Ginger_Scotsman » Wed Feb 02, 2005 1:57 pm

Door, horse, bolted

Put these words into a well-known phrase and I think you'll get how Sharman must be feeling at this moment in time.

Reading the article, it certainly highlights the fact that Phil Morle knows all too well Kazaa's problems. It took a court case to show it, but hey, at least it's out in the open now!

It also says that Sharman have new products (Kubed & Kapsules) in the pipeline, but will it be a case of too little, too late?
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Postby Wham » Wed Feb 02, 2005 2:41 pm

I don't really see what the embarrasment is here. He's only stating what was and is common knowledge even to the novice p2p user and actually to the general public at large.
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Postby JaKo30 » Wed Feb 02, 2005 3:17 pm

yeah when i 1st saw this article headline i was like :shock: lol. But it really isnt so bad. Not great but not the end of the world or p2p (as we know it).Sure I dont want defeat for Kazaa, but sometimes defeat for a tinny cheesy software program (like Kazaa) only accelarates the process for bigger better, and more advanced programs!
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Postby Anonymous » Wed Feb 02, 2005 4:05 pm

I agree with Wham, there's nothing embarassing in Morle's words. Instead it seems that he wishes to improve the software, to make it more competitive.

Many people in the p2p business, and that includes web portal owners, would profit from a Sharman downfall that would force its user base to seek out new clients & relevant information...
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Postby Fez » Wed Feb 02, 2005 4:19 pm

What the content of the article does is solidify and quantify what the p2p community accused Sharman of long ago...and they chose to ignore or excuse to their detriment.
Too bad for them...they were told, and they either went into damage control or denial rather than fix the problem.
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Postby ToM » Wed Feb 02, 2005 4:39 pm

I think we should stop being such arrogant bastards and unite together to help Sharman through this hard time in their existance. Kazaa is a pioneer application and the best of its kind. Think how much Kazaa has changed each of our lives for the better...

Why should we let losers who sit in the bedrooms creating open source software take this corperations market share? And for nothing?! Why would we want Kazaa to lose its userbase? Bram Cohen is the devil...

Would the scene exist today without Sharman Network's Kazaa? I THINK NOT! Groups which have gone against the flow and released material through less-secure methods such as topsites have been burnt big time by the likes of Operation FastLink.

Windows only, you say? Big deal! What sort of no-life loser would use anything BUT Windows anyway? Get a grip...

And as for the "useless client", who cares if it doesn't hash all of a file? As long as you stick to rips below 96kbps you'll never find a fake! Guaranteed!










Okay, I'm bored now. I think I'll stop lying.

I wonder when Phil Morle realized all of this? 1..2...3 years ago? Sharman deserve no revenue what-so-ever. Not even from the 2.5 million morons who still use their pathetic excuse for an application.
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Postby AussieMatt » Wed Feb 02, 2005 4:39 pm

You take Phils statment about spyware and then reveiw Solenecks claims how Cydoor only serves adds in Exceem and you see why the p2p comunity thinks Exceem is not the next Big thing .
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Postby Trev0r269 » Wed Feb 02, 2005 5:08 pm

Will Fasttrack and Kazaa just die already?
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Postby ashton » Wed Feb 02, 2005 6:32 pm

Trev0r269 wrote:Will Fasttrack and Kazaa just die already?

I second that motion.
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Postby gregorio » Wed Feb 02, 2005 6:32 pm

Trev0r269 wrote:Will Fasttrack and Kazaa just die already?

Good things take time.
LimeWire 4.13 is out. Don't miss it!
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Postby webe3 » Wed Feb 02, 2005 6:47 pm

What was really laughable to me was this last part:

"Consider how many people that work for Sharman Networks and its partners that hate installing Kazaa on their machines. ”


Now THAT was hilarious! Their own EMPLOYEES don't even want that junk on their machine! So why didn't they take action when they had the chance a few yaers ago?? To me, they took a big gamble when they included all of that spyware (which is what it amounts to) in their program.

Now they are paying a price....edonkey and Bit Torrent have passed them by, while they are still trying to catch up. Oh, well....I guess they had their chance and lost it because they were too hard headed to realize that the majority of peopole would not stand for that kind of junk on their computers. Too bad, Sharman, you had your chance and let your EGO get in the way! Now you are fast becoming a memory in the P2P world. I say GOOD RIDDANCE!
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Postby Allied » Wed Feb 02, 2005 6:49 pm

According to a court reporter from Apgmag.com, Sharman Networks and Altnet attempted to preserve the confidentiality of 30 documents. These documents included contracts, emails and very revealing internal memos. While the legal contracts between Sharman and Altnet are fairly standard, the internal manifesto written by CTO Phil Morle clearly indicate that Kazaa was in serious trouble from its competition.

No shit.

Kinda weird seeing "Kazaa" speaking as part of the P2P community. I always tended to think of them as the enemy. I won't forget how they took out Kazaa Lite K++ and Kceasy's fasttrack support.

However they will get some sympathy from me. I'd like to see a "Fasttrack2" come out. Along with a front end app with only adds, no spyware.
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Not Recommended: Morpheus | Kazaa | eDonkey2000 | Manolito | iMesh
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Postby SlyckChuck » Wed Feb 02, 2005 6:50 pm

Too many people that know little or nothing about p2p, know about kazaa. It is the old news story to us who have had internet access for a long time vs those who are brand new to it.

Like it or not, most people new to the net download kazaa or the lite version too. Only later do they realize by stumbling on to a page like this are they educated about the realities and see other choices available

I know I am typing old news but there are still those that do not know how harmful fasttrack really is.

1 - fake files

2 - watched closely by the entertainment industry

3 - the spyware.
* for those who do not know what spyware is go here
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Postby tsafa » Wed Feb 02, 2005 7:03 pm

kazaa was there with a solution when napster fell. They are entitled to a little respect.
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Postby NightTorch » Wed Feb 02, 2005 7:08 pm

kazaa was there with a solution when napster fell. They are entitled to a little respect.


Which they lost tenfold as soon as other programs came to be. :D
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Postby gregorio » Wed Feb 02, 2005 7:15 pm

tsafa wrote:kazaa was there with a solution when napster fell. They are entitled to a little respect.

No.
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Postby cleavebledread » Wed Feb 02, 2005 7:24 pm

tsafa wrote:kazaa was there with a solution when napster fell. They are entitled to a little respect.


KaZaA was there, not the sharman networks owned kazaa
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Postby SlyckTom » Wed Feb 02, 2005 7:27 pm

kazaa was there with a solution when napster fell. They are entitled to a little respect.


I am actually going to agree to an extent with tsfa here - at leat FastTrack deserved some props back in the days of Morpheus. Even the first versions of Kazaa were spyware and adware free (but had that dopey 128 kbps bitrate limit.) It served its purpose well for a time, but that time is over.
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Postby roomy » Wed Feb 02, 2005 7:53 pm

How should we dispose of KazaA's corpse ? Should we give it a proper burial it or simply cremate it ?
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Postby johngalt » Wed Feb 02, 2005 8:52 pm

Actually, if they go the route as Patchou, developer of Messenger Plus, a Windows / MSN Messenger add-on did, and make the installation of the other crap "Voluntary" then it will go a long way.

However, the egg on Phil's face is plain and simple - the memo show how they should not be doing what they have continued to do - the spyware additions, the lack on concern for the end user, etc. - that is major egg b/c the memo acknowledges that they are losing the battle - and yet the business plan remained the same.
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Postby tm, » Thu Feb 03, 2005 8:54 am

SlyckTom wrote:I am actually going to agree to an extent with tsfa here

Me too.

After Napster fell and Kazaa was introduced, Fasttrack was probably the best P2P network available at the time. Gnutella was horrible slow back then, eDonkey was full of corrupt files. (Imesh was quite good, however, and this was when Imesh was a central server P2P before it changed to Fasttrack protocol.) About the only other alternative was using OpenNap servers, which were in rapid decline after Music City abandoned OpenNap in favor of Fasttrack. Although it might be the worst of the major networks today, Fasttrack was state-of-the-art 4 years ago.
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Postby AussieMatt » Thu Feb 03, 2005 9:15 am

Exeem\Swarm seems to be following the same downhill run as Kazaa\Sharman has gone .

Adware supported.
Offshore trust funds set up on a tropical Island
Originating company sold after mounting legal pressure
Easy to trace users and thier sharing habits
Easy to place fakes and viri on the network,
Claims they dont put spy ware on your PC(adware cookies track you)
Totaolly Overhyped
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