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Postby Dormant707 » Sat Apr 01, 2006 8:04 am

@julesam - if you live in the UK, then perhaps you should go and visit your citizen's advice bureau for some advice on how to deal with these scammers. If you can't get any joy, then contact your credit card issuer and complain to them. If the credit card issuer won't stop the deduction or issue a refund, go to the police and lay a charge of fraud.... It may well change their tune, especially since they are registered in the UK and Wales.
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Postby zim » Sat Apr 01, 2006 3:46 pm

somehow i think they are legally protected from that anyways...


wouldnt be very good scammers otherwise.. :P
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Postby usenext suck » Sat Apr 01, 2006 4:23 pm

Julesam, By the time you read this, the charge will already be being processed.

This is EXACTLY what happened to me... The best you can do is gather up the evidence you have and contact your bank to dispute the claim and wait 3 months.

You can of course also try contacting them but that has proved fruitless for me so far.

Oh, and slap yourself for falling for it too. I did. Makes you feel slghtly better. :)

Good Luck

--------------

Zim, SS, thanks for all the advice... I will follow it all and visit those forums.
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Postby SlyckScratch » Sat Apr 01, 2006 5:50 pm

==============================================================
http://www.usenext.com - Next Generation Downloading ==============================================================

Please do not reply to this email! We do not controll the mailbox, so you will not get an answer.
For further inquiries to our support please click on http://usenext.com/index.cfm?DL=sf


They lost control of their mailbox - no wonder they lose your money
I know what you're thinking, punk. You're thinking, 'Did he use six superfluous adjectives or only five?' To tell the truth I forgot myself in all this excitement - but as I deal in English, the most powerful language in the world with subtle nuances that may blow your head clean off, you've got to ask yourself one question: 'Do I feel loquacious?' Well do you punk?
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Postby zim » Sat Apr 01, 2006 6:58 pm

spelling control wrong isnt a good sign either...
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Postby usenext suck » Sat Apr 01, 2006 7:01 pm

Yeah totally. And when you sign up, they only give you the option of Mr or Mrs... What was I thinking?! It's those little things where you go... Hmm... seems dodgy... and then if you're me you go, ah, stuff it! :P
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Postby abou105 » Sat Apr 01, 2006 7:06 pm

yea il give it a miss thanks
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Postby zim » Sat Apr 01, 2006 7:34 pm

Well i hope you both learned something at least... :)

And will be a little more wary of what sites you give any info...
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Postby julesam » Sun Apr 02, 2006 6:18 am

Thanks to all who replied with advice on how to deal with UseNext, I guess in the end I am stuck with the charge, I am just wondering what happens at the end of the year when I have forgotton all about even having the UseNext program - they will still have my debit card details and will probably keep charging me. I am going to contact my bank and see if I can put a stop to it all but I have a feeling that wont be much help. I have the UseNext number in Germany, I tried it yesterday (Sat) and it had a German recording on it of course....I will try again on a weekday to see if I get any joy from them.

Many thanks
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Power to the People!

Postby usenext suck » Sun Apr 02, 2006 3:25 pm

Received this from the CTO -

Normal font is his email to me
Bold is my reply to him
Blue is his reply to my bold.

I'm not going to continue this with him, his arguments make no sense, I got my money back and that's all I care about right now.

------------------


thank you for your answers, see my answers below (second try):



-----------------------------------------------------
Gesendet: Sonntag, 2. April 2006 11:22
An: Andreas Mihalovits
Betreff: Re: misunderderstanding




Dear Mr Mihalovitis,

Thank you for taking the time, please see my responses below.



On 4/2/06, Andreas Mihalovits wrote:


my name is Andreas Mihalovits, I am the CTO of Aviteo Ltd. offering UseNeXT to several hundred thousand pleased customers so far.

I happened to see some postings in several forums where you complained about UseNeXT and even warned people not to join this service.

Since one of our main goals is to have satisfied customers, I did some investigations to see what went wrong in this case.

Luckily you've posted a link to your homepage, where we could see the customer ID and have been therefore able to go quickly into details.

On 22/03/2006 you joined UseNeXT coming to a special "skin" of our webshop, where NO free trial is offered, see here:

http://www.usenext.com/index.cfm?sskintoken=bender

Could you remember, how you got to this link? We usually offer this link only to customers, who want to join UseNeXT, but already have had a free trial, since you are allowed to get the free trial only once.

I got to it via a reputable torrent site (torrentspy) and I assure you, I would NEVER have signed up to a paid service without experiencing some kind of free trial.

That's really strange, we will investigate, if there are more customers who have ssen the free trial, but got the full package instead. There is no other case known to me so far.

Now you defintely have joined UseNeXT coming with this link above, where UseNeXT 10+ is the default selection to buy. On the second page you should have seen the receipt showing 82,20 Euro. And after successful registration you also have got your receipt per mail.

This is not true. As you may see at: http://www.roadrider.com.au/usenext_is_a_scam while that is not the exact form, that is the one I saw and read when I signed up, no mistake about it. Note the Free trial and zero cost and comment about credit cards not being charged. I certainly noted them and this is the form I used.

As written above, I will do some more investigations, but our system says that you have registered through this special skin named "bender", where you should see all this information.

Then 10 hours later, after having downloaded 83 MB, you have cancelled the service and wrote a mail "Hi,I thought I had signed up for the 14 day trial ..." and 12 hours later you got the answer from our support team, that you unfortunatelly DID NOT register for the free trial, but for the UseNeXT 10+ offer for 7,95 Euros per month.

Again this is not true. The only email I received from your support team was the following:


In reference to your recent inquiry on 22.03.2006:

As you have cancelled your contract before we could process to initiate the refund, unfortunately we cannot do it anymore:

According to our Terms and Conditions it does not matter if you used the download volume provided by UseNeXT:

§ 3 Subject Matter of the Contract / Download Allocation
[...] In case of a lower or no data retrieve, any partial reimbursement against the agreed allocation of the month is excluded. This also applies if the customer pre-draws the allocation for the following month. It is the exclusive responsibility of the customer to utilise the allocation of the actual month before he/she pre-draws the allocation of the following month or before the following month begins.

Thus, we can not credit money for unused download volume.

Thank you for your understanding.


As you can see this response neither mentions anything about a free trial nor does it relate to my enquiry at all. They were giving me the runaround.

here are the mails, you should have also got from our support team as an answer to each of your requests approx. 12 hours later, maybe they got into your spam folder?



In reference to your recent inquiry on 22.03.2006:


We agree with the fact that you joined yesterday but you subscribed directly for UseNeXT10+ package during 12 months (probably by mistake) instead of the 14 days free trial period, that's why you have been charged for the whole year amount of money.

According to our records your request has already been edited in a separate email. If you have any further questions please do not hesitate to ask. We will be more than happy to help you.

----------------------------------------------

Your opinion is important to us! Please take a few seconds to click on the link below and let us know if this response has been helpful.

http://usenext.com/UseNextDE/Shopint/in ... 3B17BDB94A

Kind Regards,

Your
UseNeXT-Team

AND



In reference to your recent inquiry on 23.03.2006:



We are pleased to inform you that we processed to initiate a refund of 82,20 euro, that you will get on your credit card within few days.



--------------------------------------------------------------
Your opinion is important to us! Please take a few seconds to click on the link below and let us know if this response has been helpful.

http://usenext.com/UseNextDE/Shopint/in ... 203094D512

Kind Regards,

Your
UseNeXT-Team


Now, you may have looked at our site again by typing http://www.usenext.com, then you surely have seen our default skin including the free trial, where it also says "Your credit card will never be charged during your free trial, and you can cancel at any time". That may have confused you in some way...?

Absolutely not. I would never usually give my cc details first for any service, and the only reason I did is because I was sent to you via TorrentSpy and the statement of "Your credit card will never be charged while you are on the 14 day free trial" was a pretty clear statement. I trusted you.

You could try another registration, it normally works without any problems, but I will check my support team, if there have been any other similar cases so far.
But nevertheless, since you wrote to our support further mails being annoyed about the chargement, our support being customer-friendly decided to refund the money and wrote you a mail back containing "We are pleased to inform you that we processed to initiate a refund of 82,20 euro...".


Finally this is true. Although, I received the email twice with no answer to my question or any explanation. I assumed it was another way to give me the run-around. Your queues of 413 support tickets and inability for users to reply to support tickets are a turn-off and left me thinking that I would never get anything from you. I will call my bank now and see if there is anything processing. Ok, there is $136 processing, why did I lose $5? Thank you for refunding me.


that's because we have charged in euros and the exchange rate differs from day to day.



So meanwhile you should got your money back and an explanation from me, what exactly happened with your registration. Hopefully I could clarify some things and hope that you will withdraw your accusations posted to those forums soon.

Look. Of course, I appreciate getting my money back, it was the right thing to do. I feel if I had not done what I did, I wouldn't be receiving this email from you, correct? You are not clear in your explanations and you are out-right wrong with some of them. I know exactly what happened and how it happened and I am clear and concise in my argument. You tried to rip me off, I retaliated, you're making ammends. But I'm sorry, it was too little too late and there was just too much that stunk about the whole thing. I've had trouble with online companies before but you can just tell when it's a genuine mistake.

I can understand that your sceptical since you obviously have made some bad experiences with other online companies before, but please believe us, that we are a very serious company interested to offer our customers the best usenet experience. else I wouldn't not send you these mails.

The most I can do now that I've received my refund is post this discussion on the boards as well. And I will do this and allow people to make up their own mind. But I cannot remove what I wrote, you haven't convinced me that it was a 'mis-understanding', 'mistake' or anything unintentional that could be forgiven. Plus, tooo many people complain about your service. There has to be something in that. And please for the love of God, get rid of that shill, Slyder23 - he defends you so badly.

please do not judge us lonely based on forum postings, we have a lot of fans and maybe a lot of more haters, because we indeed do very aggressive advertisement especially on torrent sites.
you could take a look on our own forums (http://forum.usenext.de) to see that our current customers are quite happy with our service.
Since you had so much trouble with us and did not even had the chance to fully test our service, I also would like to send you a special test account allowing you to download 50GB for free without time limitations.


I will say this much, the software was good. It was fast, it was easy but I would like to decline this offer, thank you.

Nice to hear, that you agree with me that we offer a good software, that is fast and easy. The more I feel sorry about this technical problem, we may have had at that time you've registered.
I will let you know, what results I've got regarding my investigations about similiar cases. Until then you make think again about my offer and give us a second chance - I am sure you won't regret this!


Sincerely,
Andreas Mihalovits
Aviteo Ltd.


Just write me, if you would like to get this free offer and also how you first got to UseNeXT getting to this special skin. Maybe there is an ad campaign running somewhere including this wrong link.

Thanks,
Andreas Mihalovits
CTO, Executive Director
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Postby WildHeart » Sun Apr 02, 2006 3:42 pm

And please for the love of God, get rid of that shill, Slyder23 - he defends you so badly


Interesting that Mr. Mihalovits didn't reply to this part of the dialog.
"Be thankful we're not getting all the government we're paying for."
- Will Rogers -
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Postby usenext suck » Sun Apr 02, 2006 3:46 pm

Until then you make think again about my offer and give us a second chance - I am sure you won't regret this!

I actually think he is Slyder23, that quote rings many bells.
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Postby zim » Sun Apr 02, 2006 5:08 pm

as expected...

oh we're so sorry for your troubles. we'll look into it right away!



Sure keeps the scam going longer than "HAHAH! we got your money" would...
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Postby tm, » Sun Apr 02, 2006 9:19 pm

So it seems that the whole mess happened because they were trying to keep repeat customers from getting the free trial over again? That's a sorry excuse for having all these different sales gimmicks running simultaneously and getting them mixed. All the other Newsgroup providers can keep repeat users from getting the free trial over and over by only allowing one trial per credit card.

If UseNext was a new service, I might excuse this so-called accident - but this is just business-as-usual for them, as scores of users have been complaining about this same problem - or worse - for about the last year.

I wonder how he knew that you were posting your complaints to a dozen different forums - and so quickly, too? Did you tell them, or do they always scan the web looking for complaints about UseneXt? I wonder if a person making a big stink about getting ripped off by Kazaa Gold would likely get a refund just to silence him?

What about the part of them trying to bribe you to remove your complaints from all the forums?

I've dealt with a few companies that routinely take advantage of people, and when confronted, they are always very apologetic and shocked that this could have happened, and promise to investigate what could have possibly gone wrong and insist that it will never happen again. ... then a year passes and another thousand complaints, and still nothing has changed :x

UseneXt should have been in the military contractor business, as the government has a reputation for rarely checking its bills, and never really retaliates against major suppliers for gross overcharges. ... $100 per roll of toilet paper: - "good, ship us 5 million, on the double" :D
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Postby usenext suck » Sun Apr 02, 2006 9:35 pm

Well said tm... Don't even talk to me about military contractors... errrr.

Yes I told them I would do this if they didn't refund me and most of the posts were the same so I would not have been hard to find.

Yeah there were so many holes in his excuses I just couldn't buy it.
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Postby Midnitepoet » Tue Apr 11, 2006 12:20 am

I just got suckered by them too.
I was on 2 week trail joined on the 30th cancled today the 11th (less than 2 weeks)

I went to cancel i must have mis-clicked, on the package button and instantly renewed my account.
Charged $100+ Now I am going to contest the charge.
I do not think it is right they refuse to answer my emails and etc.. So I am refusing to pay.
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Postby usenext suck » Tue Apr 11, 2006 12:25 am

Yeah good luck mate. Just threaten them like I did.

Actually I want to ask everyone, I think we should start an email campaign to sites like torrentspy and bittorrent for advertising their links on their sites and letting them look like they're not advertising.

They should at least say they do not endorse these guys.
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Postby Midnitepoet » Tue Apr 11, 2006 12:32 am

I havent threatened.. I am just going to contest the charge Period.

Do you even think they will reverse the charge on usenext's end? I don't think so.

But looks liek at the moment I am out $100 for nothing.. But At least I have American Express to throw the balls for me.
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Postby tm, » Tue Apr 11, 2006 4:57 am

Midnitepoet wrote:I went to cancel i must have mis-clicked, on the package button and instantly renewed my account.
Charged $100+

Don't blame yourself - it appears there are thousands of others who got shanghaied the same way - and many more who got taken in other ways.

Midnitepoet wrote:I do not think it is right they refuse to answer my emails and etc..

Considering that UseneXT costs about double the price of most other newsgroup providers, it might seem odd the company can't even afford to hire a few people to answer emails. Most legitimate newsgroup providers (at least those I'm familiar with) will return emails within a few hours at most. But here the key word is "legitimate".

They make it extremely easy for people to "inadvertently" pay for 9 months service when they either start or cancel their free trial. And extremely hard to correct the "mistake" that so many of their customers find themselves in.

It's just business-as-usual for them.
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Postby Midnitepoet » Tue Apr 11, 2006 5:53 am

At least I am able to dispute the charge, and more than likey win the dispute.

I will just have to collect all this data. and with Amex I dont have to fill anything out.. and they said more than liley worst-case they will eat the $100 (82,80 Euro)
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Postby Midnitepoet » Tue Apr 11, 2006 6:24 am

Okay I am pissed.. all i get back now is this lame-ass response.


Just a back story.. I clicked on the box that seemed to be an 'offer' but infact it was the 'signup' with zero confirm if that is what you wanted. I am told by others I am screwed by the contract.. or I amjust forced to pay it. (by another forum) since it was "my fault" I even canceled within the 14 days.

I need some major advice on what to do. I have already sent a email to support saying they need to
refund mymoney or I will have to post about this on forums and dispute with my credit card company.

Hello XXXXXXXXXXX,

In reference to your recent inquiry on 11.04.2006:




Unfortunately, according to our Terms and Conditions it does not matter if you used the download volume provided by UseNeXT:


§ 3 Subject Matter of the Contract / Download Allocation
[...] In case of a lower or no data retrieve, any partial reimbursement against the agreed allocation of the month is excluded. This also applies if the customer pre-draws the allocation for the following month. It is the exclusive responsibility of the customer to utilise the allocation of the actual month before he/she pre-draws the allocation of the following month or before the following month begins.

Thus, we can not credit money for unused download volume.


Please do not hesitate to contact us again for further queries.




--------------------------------------------------------------
Your opinion is important to us! Please take a few seconds to click on the link below and let us know if this response has been helpful.


http://usenext.com/UseNextDE/Shopint/in ... 52D8BDBF11

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Postby zim » Tue Apr 11, 2006 7:10 am

call your credit card company and claim its a fraudulent charge.


Dont tell them the story. Dont say anything about the trial or signup at all.

Just say that charge is not yours and you want it removed from your credit card.

all you gotta do.
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Postby Midnitepoet » Tue Apr 11, 2006 7:13 am

I already told them the story.. AMex doesnt have a problem with it.

But what is these rumors I hear on another forum.. Unlocker forums that usenext is a police sting/trap?


Alas I think its 99.9% chance it is BS.

But as a Gold Card Amex member.. it is covered under my benifts.
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Postby Midnitepoet » Tue Apr 11, 2006 7:15 am

AH yes.. VICTORY!

We are pleased to inform you that we initiated a refund of your transaction that you will receive within few days.

Please feel free to contact us again for further queries.


:D :D :D :D :D

Now to just watch the card.. I may change the # so they cant charge me in the future.
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Postby SlyckScratch » Tue Apr 11, 2006 7:56 am

Midnitepoet wrote:But what is these rumors I hear on another forum.. Unlocker forums that usenext is a police sting/trap?


:lol: :lol:

Anyone else wanting a laugh should click the link below

http://www.unlocker-forums.co.uk/showthread.php?t=35827
I know what you're thinking, punk. You're thinking, 'Did he use six superfluous adjectives or only five?' To tell the truth I forgot myself in all this excitement - but as I deal in English, the most powerful language in the world with subtle nuances that may blow your head clean off, you've got to ask yourself one question: 'Do I feel loquacious?' Well do you punk?
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