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Private DC Network via Hamachi

Postby Revliskciuq » Tue Nov 01, 2005 11:00 pm

First and foremost, this is not an advertisement, just a proposal to individuals who might be interested.

I am looking into starting a private Direct Connect network under Hamachi. If you are not familiar with Hamachi, in a nutshell it it allows the creation of private and anonymous VPN's, you can check it out here: http://hamachi.cc

The goal is provide a small network to roughly 10 individuals, the network would offer a good file trading atmosphere, good social atmosphere, and of course anonymity.

I'm not really interested in gaining access to someone's blockbuster DivX collection - that isn't what I want this to be about. I want this to be as much of a cultural experience as anything else, where people can hear and see new things, and likewise expose others to their unique tastes.

Anyone seriously interested?
Last edited by Revliskciuq on Wed Nov 02, 2005 12:42 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Postby zbeast » Tue Nov 01, 2005 11:08 pm

sounds like a cool Idea.
I have no Idea how you get DC++ to connect across Hamachi.
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Postby notbob » Tue Nov 01, 2005 11:18 pm

this is how my buddy cpu did it, your individual results may vary
okay, here's how i did it. (obviously not for the faint of heart)

Assumptions:
1. your hub owner is okay with this and has your full cooperation [or you are the hub owner]
2. your hub is running on a *nix system
3. OpenSSH is insalled and running.
4. You are relatively competent with *nix systems.

okay, here goes:

first you need to configure OpenSSH to allow only connections authenticated through public key cryptography. in your sshd configuration file you need to have PasswordAuthentication no.

now you will need to make a decision. in order to create the tunnel, a user has to log in. you can either use the same login ID, key-set, and passphrase for everyone...or you can create uniquie logins for everyone. this is not related to the hub login stuff...and granting this account will also grant the user a shell account on your *nix machine. for information on how to set up accounts with SSH DSA encrypted logins, go here. (Please note that depending on how you create your keyset, you may need to convert your private key from openssh format to putty format...this is easy to do with PuTTYgen, which is available from putty's website

after you have that set up, and you are able to SSH into the machine with your newly created keyset...you're ready to create a tunnel to the machine to connect to the hub. here's the command line to do it with PuTTY:

cd path\to\putty
start putty.exe -2 -L 411:hub.hostname.com:411 username@hub.hostname.com -i C:\path\to\yourprivatekey.ppk

that command will bring up a putty window, ask for the passphrase you assigned to your keyset, and then it will create a tunnel from port 411 on the hub machine on port 411 on the local machine. by default, only the localhost will be allowed to connect to the hub using this tunnel.

it's no hay ride, but it can be done. and it could also be integrated into hub and client software as HardwareHank suggested...but i don't see it happening any time soon.
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Postby Revliskciuq » Tue Nov 01, 2005 11:20 pm

Quite simple (I have already set this up):

You simply install PtokaX (DC hub server), along with Hamashi onto the hub server. In the hub's configuration you configure its IP address to be that server's Hamashi address, and there you go.

For a client to connect to the hub they simply start Hamashi and connect to the same Hamashi network which the DC hub server is connected to (usually the DC hub server hosts the network, for simplicity's sake). Then in DC++ you put the Hub's Hamashi address into the hub connect window, and voila - anonymous, private, p2p.
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Postby Revliskciuq » Tue Nov 01, 2005 11:21 pm

I just want to add that I've created a mock setup with what I just described, and it worked flawlessly.
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Postby notbob » Tue Nov 01, 2005 11:26 pm

you can make a private dc network without hamachi at all, the feature is built into all the hub software

is the addition of vpn support what you are talking about here? what is the benefit of running hamachi?
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Postby truman » Tue Nov 01, 2005 11:31 pm

Hamachi is very cool piece of a software, but you must remember that it only provides privacy, not anonymity.
Anyone you connnect to will see your Internet IP address.
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Postby alien x » Tue Nov 01, 2005 11:36 pm

Why don't you use Qnext? you can have your private network with Universal Messenger, Audio Chat, Video Conferencing, Photo Sharing,File Transfer,File Sharing,Group Text Chat,Online Gaming,QnextMyPC
Music Streaming and IRC.
http://www.qnext.com/
just install the software and off you go..... :P
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Postby notbob » Tue Nov 01, 2005 11:46 pm

alien x wrote:Why don't you use Qnext? you can have your private network with Universal Messenger, Audio Chat, Video Conferencing, Photo Sharing,File Transfer,File Sharing,Group Text Chat,Online Gaming,QnextMyPC
Music Streaming and IRC.
http://www.qnext.com/
just install the software and off you go..... :P


because qnext is a for profit product

why use that, when it could be shut down by the feds/RIAA whatever, when dc++ can be set up, used, and run by anyone for free? dc++ is also open source and can be modified to meet your specific needs
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Postby Revliskciuq » Tue Nov 01, 2005 11:48 pm

Hamachi is very cool piece of a software, but you must remember that it only provides privacy, not anonymity.
Anyone you connnect to will see your Internet IP address.


Are you sure you are right on this, the whole idea is that you use your Hamachi address, NOT your IP address. In fact when I go into my DC hub and look at my test client connection, it only lists their Hamashi address.

As far as I know you can't resolve an IP address from a Hamashi address, and that's the whole idea.
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Postby notbob » Tue Nov 01, 2005 11:53 pm

Revliskciuq wrote:
Hamachi is very cool piece of a software, but you must remember that it only provides privacy, not anonymity.
Anyone you connnect to will see your Internet IP address.


Are you sure you are right on this, the whole idea is that you use your Hamachi address, NOT your IP address. In fact when I go into my DC hub and look at my test client connection, it only lists their Hamashi address.

As far as I know you can't resolve an IP address from a Hamashi address, and that's the whole idea.


if i download a file from you, and type netstat-an in the command prompt, it doesn't matter what your hamachi address is, i'll get your ip address, especially since the hub and hamachi are the same computer
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Postby Revliskciuq » Tue Nov 01, 2005 11:56 pm

Not true, I did that and still got a Hamachi address.
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Postby Revliskciuq » Wed Nov 02, 2005 12:00 am

I just did some more testing and the case is the same, the only thing that resolves from netstat -an is a Hamachi address, which is the entire reason I suggested the DC server run under Hamachi.
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Postby notbob » Wed Nov 02, 2005 12:04 am

Revliskciuq wrote:Not true, I did that and still got a Hamachi address.


you can't test that, since you can't download from yourself as the only member of a hub

from hamachi
Hamachi is a UDP-based virtual private networking system. Its peers utilize the help of a 3rd node called mediation server to locate each other and to boot strap the connection between themselves. The connection itself is direct and once it's established no traffic flows through our servers.


once a download starts, you will be able to have the other guy's IP, as the hamachi is only a handshake to get user a to user b (no traffic goes over hamachi's servers)
Last edited by notbob on Wed Nov 02, 2005 12:09 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Postby LANjackal » Wed Nov 02, 2005 12:07 am

Interesting thread. Just a question? Why DC++ specifically? Why not Lan2P - it was built from the ground up to adapt to any network configuration. It's free and has no bundled spyware, etc. Site:

http://lan2p.smashsworld.com/

For those too lazy to click the link ;), here are the primary features:

ZERO network configuration* (it configures itself)
takes advantage of, but does not rely on UDP (for networks that have it turned off)
UNSTOPPABLE in almost ALL network configurations!
adjusts to filtering (ports turned off? no problem!)
mathematical protocol ENCRYPTION, for additional privacy
nickname support
fast searches and transfers (depends on network speed)
search by keyword, file type, or by user
see a list of users that are online
NO spyware/adware/or anything but the actual software
simple, clean interface... no unnecessary features
Chat with other users.
Instant Messaging
Privacy Controls (User Blocking)
Resumable Downloads from Different Sources
System Tray Alerts (configurable, can be disabled)
NEW IN BETA 15! Transfer, IM, Chat, and Protocol Improvements. LanIM Interactivity. Bug fixes.

*you still have to configure your shared and download fold


I've never found DC++ particularly easy to use (that's just me).

It's just a suggestion. Take a look and tell me what you think.
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Postby Revliskciuq » Wed Nov 02, 2005 12:10 am

Notbob, that isn't how I tested it. If you really doubt me, or seriously think I am missing something, than please mirror my setup:


Machine 1 (Server): Hub Server + Hamachi + DC++ installed

On this machine I configured the DC++ client to share a local file, and connect to the hub hosted on the same machine through Hamachi.

Machine 2 (Client): Hamachi + DC++ installed

On this machine I connect to the hub hosted on Machine 1 through Hamachi and download a file from the DC++ client running on machine 1.


When I run netstat -an the only foreign address I resolve is the Hamachi address.
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Postby Revliskciuq » Wed Nov 02, 2005 12:12 am

notbob, if you want to connect to me and test this, I'd be happy to give it a try.
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Postby notbob » Wed Nov 02, 2005 12:13 am

Revliskciuq wrote:notbob, if you want to connect to me and test this, I'd be happy to give it a try.


pm me, and have a small non threatening file ready

i'm playing with hamachi, and it is interesting, but i don't think it is a magic anonymizer of any sort
Last edited by notbob on Wed Nov 02, 2005 12:22 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Postby SlyckChuck » Wed Nov 02, 2005 12:19 am

Notbob knows a lot about DC++. Take his advice. 8)
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Postby Revliskciuq » Wed Nov 02, 2005 12:21 am

I'm not trying to be stubborn, I just want to see it, and I appreciate him taking the time to show me :).
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Postby notbob » Wed Nov 02, 2005 12:51 am

all i get is the hamachi IP

i'd like to test it more, but it seems legit

(now if someone wanted an IP, they could get it from the hamachi people like they would an ISP, but otherwise it's neat)
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Postby Revliskciuq » Wed Nov 02, 2005 12:53 am

Pretty neat, huh?
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Postby truman » Wed Nov 02, 2005 12:53 am

Revliskciuq, select someone who's online in Hamachi (click on his item in main Hamachi list) and let tooltip to surface. You will see his real IP there.
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Postby Revliskciuq » Wed Nov 02, 2005 12:56 am

Wow there you go then, that took the wind out of my sails - now why the hell would they have it do that? netstat fails to resolve the IP, and so does DC++, yet they have it right there for you in the Hamachi program.

Regardless, I still like the idea of running a DC server under Hamachi because it remains invisible to anyone outside of the network.

For anyone that might be interested, I am going to move ahead with this. I'll be watching my PM's.
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Postby Progz » Fri Nov 04, 2005 7:14 pm

LANjackal wrote:Interesting thread. Just a question? Why DC++ specifically? Why not Lan2P - it was built from the ground up to adapt to any network configuration. It's free and has no bundled spyware, etc. Site:

http://lan2p.smashsworld.com/

For those too lazy to click the link ;), here are the primary features:

ZERO network configuration* (it configures itself)
takes advantage of, but does not rely on UDP (for networks that have it turned off)
UNSTOPPABLE in almost ALL network configurations!
adjusts to filtering (ports turned off? no problem!)
mathematical protocol ENCRYPTION, for additional privacy
nickname support
fast searches and transfers (depends on network speed)
search by keyword, file type, or by user
see a list of users that are online
NO spyware/adware/or anything but the actual software
simple, clean interface... no unnecessary features
Chat with other users.
Instant Messaging
Privacy Controls (User Blocking)
Resumable Downloads from Different Sources
System Tray Alerts (configurable, can be disabled)
NEW IN BETA 15! Transfer, IM, Chat, and Protocol Improvements. LanIM Interactivity. Bug fixes.

*you still have to configure your shared and download fold


I've never found DC++ particularly easy to use (that's just me).

It's just a suggestion. Take a look and tell me what you think.


That stuff doesnt work on it...

If you guys are gonna do P2P and have it Private just download Shifty on your comps. Do a google search then get people into your hamachi network and it will work and the DC++ server does work, and yes you need your Hamachi IP not your real IP. Im on that forum like 24/7 look for the username Progz.
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